Structural Engineering: 2008-05-11

Saturday, May 17, 2008

Re: OT--Beer - Since when is beer off topic?

This is a little too off topic. Since I couldn't find a beer can on
FaceBook to throw at Chris, I threw a birthday cake at him instead. (Opps.
The secret's out.)

----Original Message Follows----
From: Christopher Wright <chrisw@skypoint.com>
Reply-To: <seaint@seaint.org>
To: <seaint@seaint.org>
Subject: Re: OT--Beer - Since when is beer off topic?
Date: Sat, 17 May 2008 11:09:54 -0500

On May 17, 2008, at 8:19 AM, Gary L. Hodgson and Assoc. wrote:

>My favourite is still Newcastle Brown Ale (even though I am Canadian) and
>they had it in Las Vegas which was nice.
Good lord, man--why would you do such a thing. You come from the land of
Upper Canada ale, which is as good as any of the really fine locals which
have been resurrecting themselves around Minnesota. When I get to Canada, I
try to bring back a couple of 8 packs, even though the draft product seems
tastier although maybe it's the civilized company. Even the otherwise
fairly surly US immigration people in the Toronto airport recognize the
good stuff when they see it.

Someday, if the engineering business should make me filthy rich enough,
I'll consider having Upper Canada ale piped into my house, except I
wouldn't want to shave in it.

Christopher Wright P.E. |"They couldn't hit an elephant at
chrisw@skypoint.com | this distance" (last words of Gen.
.......................................| John Sedgwick, Spotsylvania 1864)
http://www.skypoint.com/~chrisw/

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Mac Arthur Maze Discussion on Barbara Simpson Talk Show

Dear SEA-Int Friends:
I will be on the Barbara Simpson Show Today Saturday May 17, 4:00 Pm to
discuss Mac Arthur Maze collapse and reconstruction. The URL for on line
talk show is:http://www.ksfo560.com/showdj.asp?djid=2364

Last week I presented our research results on this topic on Campus and
Chronicle covered it:
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/05/08/BAP210IEAK.DTL&hw=Astaneh&sn=001&sc=1000

Sincerely

Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Professor and Consultant on Structural Engineering, Earthquake Engineering
and protection of Buildings and Bridges against Blast and Impact.

=====================================

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Gusset Plates in Steel Bridges, Design, Evaluation and Retrofit

Last week I presented our research results on this topic on Campus and
Chronicle covered it:
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/05/08/BAP210IEAK.DTL&hw=Astaneh&sn=001&sc=1000

Sincerely

Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Professor and Consultant on Structural Engineering, Earthquake Engineering
and protection of Buildings and Bridges against Blast and Impact.

=====================================

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Gusset Plates in Steel Bridges, Design, Evaluation and Retrofit

Dear SEA-Int Friends:
Apparently, a fourth bridge has gusset plate problems! No, not in
Minnesota as the previous 3 cases were , but this one is in South Dakota:
http://en.structurae.de/structures/data/index.cfm?id=s0000952

. Some
info. on the bridge is here:
http://en.structurae.de/structures/data/index.cfm?id=s0000952

Yesterday I was telling MPR (Minnesota Public Radio ) reporter that it
is not just Minnesota that has this gusset plate problem, the reason
Minnesota is finding these problems is that you are looking at your
bridges more carefully because of of the 35W tragic collapse. if other
states look into their steel truss bridges, they might find some of them
problematic. Then this morning comes this news from S.D..

FYI, at last Monday meeting, the Structural Steel Educational Council,
publisher of the Steel TIPS reports, kindly approved my proposal for
authoring a Steel TIPS report on "Gusset Plates in Steel Bridges-Design
, Evaluation and Retrofit" .
As I have done for most of Steel TIPS I have done, I am writing to ask
for you advice, input and suggestion on any item that you think I should
include or in any way you like to see addressed.
I appreciate your time on this and will take all your input very
seriously and let you know how I implemented your comments. You can
either post your comments here or you can send them to me privately.
Specially the advice from bridge engineers out there will be very
valuable and much appreciated.

Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Professor and Consultant on Structural Engineering, Earthquake Engineering
and protection of Buildings and Bridges against Blast and Impact.

=====================================

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RE: Alterations Chapter 34 2007 CBC

Do I have the wrong code?

3403.2.3.2 has two limits; 5% reduced strength and 10% increase of
seismic force.

A modified element is no longer an existing condition. Include in the
modification reinforcement to prevent a more than 5% reduction in
strength and to prevent more than a 10% increase of force to it and
elsewhere.
If another element does increase more than 10%, then make it part of the
new by reinforcing it also. This becomes more of a concern if the
stiffness of the first element is reduced by about 20%.

I think what might be more likely to kick in a full upgrade is when one
adds an average seismic weight to a whole floor or building. Or a change
in use.

David Merrick, SE

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Re: OT--Beer - Since when is beer off topic?

On May 17, 2008, at 8:19 AM, Gary L. Hodgson and Assoc. wrote:

> My favourite is still Newcastle Brown Ale (even though I am
> Canadian) and they had it in Las Vegas which was nice.
Good lord, man--why would you do such a thing. You come from the land
of Upper Canada ale, which is as good as any of the really fine
locals which have been resurrecting themselves around Minnesota. When
I get to Canada, I try to bring back a couple of 8 packs, even though
the draft product seems tastier although maybe it's the civilized
company. Even the otherwise fairly surly US immigration people in the
Toronto airport recognize the good stuff when they see it.

Someday, if the engineering business should make me filthy rich
enough, I'll consider having Upper Canada ale piped into my house,
except I wouldn't want to shave in it.

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OT--Beer - Since when is beer off topic?

List,
I am writing to apologize for criticizing American beer two weeks ago.
There was an article in the Toronto Star this week (largest circulation
in Canada) about American beer saying that it has undeserved reputation
up here and some other places. It said there was justification for that
about25-30 years ago but since then the number of breweries has
quadrupled and there are some very good beers there. It went on to name
some. I intended to keep the article, but my wife threw it out. By the
way how did get off the topic of beer and onto hum-drum engineering. I
tried Fat Tire when I was in Las Vegas but didn't like it - tried others
but can't remember their names. My favourite is still Newcastle Brown
Ale (even though I am Canadian) and they had it in Las Vegas which was nice.
Cheers
Gary

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Friday, May 16, 2008

RE: [CONCRETE] When Is Concrete "Cracked"?

You can also get “Crack Comparator Cards” from CTL Group. Here’s the link:

http://www.ctlgroup.com/contacts/cardform.asp?topic=2163

-- Joel

(To anyone at CTL Group, I’m sorry if your stock price suddenly drops because you have to supply cards to everyone on this list.)

From: Ehrlich, Gary [mailto:gehrlich@nahb.com]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 3:06 PM
To: seaint@seaint.org
Subject: RE: [CONCRETE] When Is Concrete "Cracked"?

That sounds about right to me. There is guidance IIRC in ACI 224.1R-07: “Causes, Evaluation, and Repair of Cracks in Concrete Structures”, but I don’t have a copy lying around to check.

Somewhere around I have a nice wallet-sized card from Sika with a range of crack widths marked along the edges.

Gary

Gary J. Ehrlich, PE
Program Manager, Structural Codes & Standards
National Association of Home Builders (NAHB)
1201 15th Street, NW, Washington, DC 20005
ph: 202-266-8545 or 800-368-5242 x8545
fax: 202-266-8369
gehrlich@nahb.com

From: Richard L. Hess [mailto:RLHess@HessEng.com]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 3:32 PM
To: seaint@seaint.org
Subject: RE: [CONCRETE] When Is Concrete "Cracked"?

I have always heard that 0.6mm or 0.025 in., or whether you can stick a credit card in it is a useful measure. Of course that is too simple for a committeeman at ACI to consider.

Richard Hess

-----Original Message-----
From: bill@polhemus.cc [mailto:bill@polhemus.cc]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 11:42 AM
To: seaint@seaint.org
Subject: [CONCRETE] When Is Concrete "Cracked"?

I know that reinforced concrete "always cracks," but what is the criterion for determining when it is "too cracked;" that is, that the cracks are significant enough to need attention?

Seriously, I've had a tough time finding a defnition of this in ACI documents, etc.

RE: [CONCRETE] When Is Concrete "Cracked"?

See Table 4.1 in ACI 224R-01.

See ACI 318-05, Section R10.6.4 for what little 318 says about cracks.

For liquid-containing structures, see section R10.6.4 in ACI 350-06 for a more detailed discussion of flexural cracks. Full thickness cracks (such as shrinkage cracks) typically start leaking at about 0.004-in width.

Bill Sherman

CH2M HILL / DEN

720-286-2792

From: bill@polhemus.cc [mailto:bill@polhemus.cc]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 12:42 PM
To: seaint@seaint.org
Subject: [CONCRETE] When Is Concrete "Cracked"?

I know that reinforced concrete "always cracks," but what is the criterion for determining when it is "too cracked;" that is, that the cracks are significant enough to need attention?

Seriously, I've had a tough time finding a defnition of this in ACI documents, etc.

RE: [CONCRETE] When Is Concrete "Cracked"?

That sounds about right to me. There is guidance IIRC in ACI 224.1R-07: “Causes, Evaluation, and Repair of Cracks in Concrete Structures”, but I don’t have a copy lying around to check.

Somewhere around I have a nice wallet-sized card from Sika with a range of crack widths marked along the edges.

Gary

From: Richard L. Hess [mailto:RLHess@HessEng.com]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 3:32 PM
To: seaint@seaint.org
Subject: RE: [CONCRETE] When Is Concrete "Cracked"?

I have always heard that 0.6mm or 0.025 in., or whether you can stick a credit card in it is a useful measure. Of course that is too simple for a committeeman at ACI to consider.

Richard Hess

-----Original Message-----
From: bill@polhemus.cc [mailto:bill@polhemus.cc]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 11:42 AM
To: seaint@seaint.org
Subject: [CONCRETE] When Is Concrete "Cracked"?

I know that reinforced concrete "always cracks," but what is the criterion for determining when it is "too cracked;" that is, that the cracks are significant enough to need attention?

Seriously, I've had a tough time finding a defnition of this in ACI documents, etc.

Re: [CONCRETE] When Is Concrete "Cracked"? [it depends]

"Too cracked" for what?

I just looked at a foundation that had a crack that was close to 1/2" wide and I told them it was no concern -- because it was in a house that's almost a century old and there are no other signs of problems. If I saw the same crack in a slab or beam I would be *very* concerned.

Context is all.

Ralph

In a message dated 5/16/08 12:40:50 PM, RLHess@HessEng.com writes:

I have always heard that 0.6mm or 0.025 in., or whether you can stick a credit card in it is a useful measure. Of course that is too simple for a committeeman at ACI to consider.
Richard Hess

-----Original Message-----
From: bill@polhemus.cc [mailto:bill@polhemus.cc]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 11:42 AM
To: seaint@seaint.org
Subject: [CONCRETE] When Is Concrete "Cracked"?

I know that reinforced concrete "always cracks," but what is the criterion for determining when it is "too cracked;" that is, that the cracks are significant enough to need attention?
Seriously, I've had a tough time finding a defnition of this in ACI documents, etc.

**************
Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food.
(http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod00030000000001)

RE: [CONCRETE] When Is Concrete "Cracked"?

I have always heard that 0.6mm or 0.025 in., or whether you can stick a credit card in it is a useful measure. Of course that is too simple for a committeeman at ACI to consider.

Richard Hess

-----Original Message-----
From: bill@polhemus.cc [mailto:bill@polhemus.cc]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 11:42 AM
To: seaint@seaint.org
Subject: [CONCRETE] When Is Concrete "Cracked"?

I know that reinforced concrete "always cracks," but what is the criterion for determining when it is "too cracked;" that is, that the cracks are significant enough to need attention?

Seriously, I've had a tough time finding a defnition of this in ACI documents, etc.

Re: Stamping Calcs

That is what we always do. Except maybe 1-4 sheet..if it less time than cover sheet

Joe Venuti
Johnson & Nielsen Associates
Palm Springs, CA

Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food.

[CONCRETE] When Is Concrete "Cracked"?

I know that reinforced concrete "always cracks," but what is the criterion for determining when it is "too cracked;" that is, that the cracks are significant enough to need attention?

Seriously, I've had a tough time finding a defnition of this in ACI documents, etc.

Re: Stamping Calcs

I'd make a full size sheet, copy/pdf/sticky back the calcs/details/specs onto it, and stamp and sign that sheet. even add a little note next to your stamp stating the general purpose or intent of the new sheet. The city inspector will then have one sheet to look at, and it has already been approved "over the counter." Done this before with no issues. HTH.

On Fri, May 16, 2008 at 10:29 AM, Michel Blangy <mblangy@satco-inc.com> wrote:

Hi Terry,

I posted an amendment to my initial post. The project is for site retaining
walls. Seems the PCer wants my detail sketchs and spec sheets stamped as
they will be used for construction and separate from the approved drawing
set.

Michel Blangy, P.E.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Terry Weatherby [mailto:terry@wrfed.com]
> Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 10:24 AM
> To: seaint@seaint.org
> Subject: RE: Stamping Calcs
>
>

> Hi Michel;
> California Business and Professions Code requires only the cover
> sheet of the calculations needs to be stamped. Are you in California? I
> can get you the exact section if you are. Through our local Mother Lode
> chapter of CELSOC (ACEC California), we provide all the local
> jurisdictions
> with a copy of the Business and Professions Code. What jurisdiction asked
> you to do this?
> I know many jurisdictions ignore this when it comes to Truss
> Calculations – they want every single sheet stamped. Are these truss
> calculations?
> Good luck and take care,
>
>
> Terry Weatherby
> Weatherby-Reynolds-Fritson
> Engineering and Design
> Jackson, CA
>
> ________________________________________
> From: Michel Blangy [mailto:mblangy@satco-inc.com]
> Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 8:55 AM
> To: Seaint@Seaint. Org
> Subject: Stamping Calcs
>
> Plan Checker wants EVERY SINGLE SHEET STAMPED. How can I get out of this?
>
>
> Michel Blangy, P.E.
>
>
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--
David Topete, SE

RE: Stamping Calcs - designs

Michel,

If it's a construction drawing it needs to be stamped. If you paste it
on larger sheets you'll have fewer sheets to stamp.

Dave Gaines

-----Original Message-----
From: Michel Blangy [mailto:mblangy@satco-inc.com]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 10:29 AM
To: seaint@seaint.org
Subject: RE: Stamping Calcs

Hi Terry,

I posted an amendment to my initial post. The project is for site
retaining walls. Seems the PCer wants my detail sketchs and spec sheets
stamped as they will be used for construction and separate from the
approved drawing set.

Michel Blangy, P.E.

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Stamping Calcs

False alarm.

I just spoke to the plan checker directly. As my calcs contain details for use in construction along with the specs. he wants those sheets stamped - about 10 pages worth out of 40. Makes sense to me, but not the architect.

It is nice to see how quickly we jump to the defense of one another when it comes to plan checkers.

Michel

RE: Stamping Calcs

Hi Terry,

I posted an amendment to my initial post. The project is for site retaining
walls. Seems the PCer wants my detail sketchs and spec sheets stamped as
they will be used for construction and separate from the approved drawing
set.

Michel Blangy, P.E.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Terry Weatherby [mailto:terry@wrfed.com]
> Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 10:24 AM
> To: seaint@seaint.org
> Subject: RE: Stamping Calcs
>
>
> Hi Michel;
> California Business and Professions Code requires only the cover
> sheet of the calculations needs to be stamped. Are you in California? I
> can get you the exact section if you are. Through our local Mother Lode
> chapter of CELSOC (ACEC California), we provide all the local
> jurisdictions
> with a copy of the Business and Professions Code. What jurisdiction asked
> you to do this?
> I know many jurisdictions ignore this when it comes to Truss
> Calculations – they want every single sheet stamped. Are these truss
> calculations?
> Good luck and take care,
>
>
> Terry Weatherby
> Weatherby-Reynolds-Fritson
> Engineering and Design
> Jackson, CA
>
> ________________________________________
> From: Michel Blangy [mailto:mblangy@satco-inc.com]
> Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 8:55 AM
> To: Seaint@Seaint. Org
> Subject: Stamping Calcs
>
> Plan Checker wants EVERY SINGLE SHEET STAMPED. How can I get out of this?
>
>
> Michel Blangy, P.E.
>
>
> ******* ****** ******* ******** ******* ******* ******* ***
> * Read list FAQ at: http://www.seaint.org/list_FAQ.asp
> *
> * This email was sent to you via Structural Engineers
> * Association of Southern California (SEAOSC) server. To
> * subscribe (no fee) or UnSubscribe, please go to:
> *
> *

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RE: Stamping Calcs

Hi Michel;
California Business and Professions Code requires only the cover
sheet of the calculations needs to be stamped. Are you in California? I
can get you the exact section if you are. Through our local Mother Lode
chapter of CELSOC (ACEC California), we provide all the local jurisdictions
with a copy of the Business and Professions Code. What jurisdiction asked
you to do this?
I know many jurisdictions ignore this when it comes to Truss
Calculations – they want every single sheet stamped. Are these truss
calculations?
Good luck and take care,

Terry Weatherby
Weatherby-Reynolds-Fritson
Engineering and Design
Jackson, CA

________________________________________
From: Michel Blangy [mailto:mblangy@satco-inc.com]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 8:55 AM
To: Seaint@Seaint. Org
Subject: Stamping Calcs

Plan Checker wants EVERY SINGLE SHEET STAMPED. How can I get out of this?

Michel Blangy, P.E.

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Re: Stamping Calcs

I once submitted calcs and forgot to page number it, it was about 8 sheets of calcs. Got the same comment.

Once I put the numbers on, the title page takes care of it.

-gm

On Fri, May 16, 2008 at 9:26 AM, Gaines, David <David.Gaines@hdrinc.com> wrote:

Michel,

This could be a really huge task if you had a 1200 page, 4 binder set of calcs on a large project.

I like to have an index at the front of the calcs listing the subject headings and page numbers. Then I have a record of what I provided, it's easier to find things and I only need to stamp the cover sheet or index.

Dave Gaines, P.E.

Structural Project Engineer
HDR ONE COMPANY | Many Solutions
251 S. Lake Ave, Suite 1000
Pasadena, CA 91101
T: 626.584.4960
F: 626.584.1750
email: david.gaines@hdrinc.com

From: Michel Blangy [mailto:mblangy@satco-inc.com]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 8:55 AM
To: Seaint@Seaint. Org
Subject: Stamping Calcs

Plan Checker wants EVERY SINGLE SHEET STAMPED. How can I get out of this?

Michel Blangy, P.E.

Re: Stamping Calcs

On May 16, 2008, at 10:54 AM, Michel Blangy wrote:

> Plan Checker wants EVERY SINGLE SHEET STAMPED. How can I get out of
> this?
I usually put my calculations in a formal report with a cover and
sheets indicating how many pages there are and the Rev level, my
initials and date of each. Each calculation is also listed
individually in the table of contents. I sign and date the cover
sheet with my registration number, and stamp the Revision record,
also with a signature attesting the stamp is mine. I don't deal with
building officials, but it's good enough for the NRC.

I don't know if that'll save you any trouble, but it's a good way to
maintain an audit trail of the work I submit.

******* ****** ******* ******** ******* ******* ******* ***
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RE: Stamping Calcs

Michel,

This could be a really huge task if you had a 1200 page, 4 binder set of calcs on a large project.

I like to have an index at the front of the calcs listing the subject headings and page numbers. Then I have a record of what I provided, it's easier to find things and I only need to stamp the cover sheet or index.

Dave Gaines, P.E.

Structural Project Engineer
HDR ONE COMPANY | Many Solutions
251 S. Lake Ave, Suite 1000
Pasadena, CA 91101
T: 626.584.4960
F: 626.584.1750
email: david.gaines@hdrinc.com

From: Michel Blangy [mailto:mblangy@satco-inc.com]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 8:55 AM
To: Seaint@Seaint. Org
Subject: Stamping Calcs

Plan Checker wants EVERY SINGLE SHEET STAMPED. How can I get out of this?

Michel Blangy, P.E.

RE: Stamping Calcs

Oops, didn’t read the subject of the post. This is not normal and I have no idea why the plan checker would require this. I guess my response would be “show me this requirement in the code.” Of course, that might anger the plan checker, which would not help your cause. I think you should ask, very earnestly, why they feel this needs to be done, particularly if you have never had to do it before. Very strange.

Let us (or just me) know how this works out.

Doug Mayer, SE

From: Chance, Acie [mailto:AChance@lacsd.org]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 9:11 AM
To: seaint@seaint.org
Subject: RE: Stamping Calcs

When the checker requires it I number the pages of the calculation 1 of 30, 2 of 30, est..... This has always worked in the past.

Acie Chance

-----Original Message-----
From: Doug Mayer [mailto:doug.mayer@taylorteter.com]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 9:03 AM
To: seaint@seaint.org
Subject: RE: Stamping Calcs

Maybe it is just CA, but I thought this was a standard requirement.

Doug Mayer, SE

From: Michel Blangy [mailto:mblangy@satco-inc.com]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 8:55 AM
To: Seaint@Seaint. Org
Subject: Stamping Calcs

Plan Checker wants EVERY SINGLE SHEET STAMPED. How can I get out of this?

Michel Blangy, P.E.

Visit our new website at www.taylorteter.com

Visit our new website at www.taylorteter.com

RE: Stamping Calcs

When the checker requires it I number the pages of the calculation 1 of 30, 2 of 30, est..... This has always worked in the past.

Acie Chance

-----Original Message-----
From: Doug Mayer [mailto:doug.mayer@taylorteter.com]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 9:03 AM
To: seaint@seaint.org
Subject: RE: Stamping Calcs

Maybe it is just CA, but I thought this was a standard requirement.

Doug Mayer, SE

From: Michel Blangy [mailto:mblangy@satco-inc.com]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 8:55 AM
To: Seaint@Seaint. Org
Subject: Stamping Calcs

Plan Checker wants EVERY SINGLE SHEET STAMPED. How can I get out of this?

Michel Blangy, P.E.

Visit our new website at www.taylorteter.com

RE: Stamping Calcs

Maybe it is just CA, but I thought this was a standard requirement.

Doug Mayer, SE

From: Michel Blangy [mailto:mblangy@satco-inc.com]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 8:55 AM
To: Seaint@Seaint. Org
Subject: Stamping Calcs

Plan Checker wants EVERY SINGLE SHEET STAMPED. How can I get out of this?

Michel Blangy, P.E.

Visit our new website at www.taylorteter.com

Stamping Calcs

Plan Checker wants EVERY SINGLE SHEET STAMPED. How can I get out of this?

Michel Blangy, P.E.

Re: Damaged Calculator

Hi all,

Maybe I go off a little bit, and please don't beat me to death for this. I had a Casio calculator I bought at Target 19 years ago, don't remember the price. Probably $10 at that time, and it helped me thru my college years, many exams, quizzes, EIT, BS, MS, comprehensive exam, PE....and it still worked fine. I only realized that it was outlawed when I wanted to take the SE few years ago.

I bought a new Casio per spec, didn't like it much. Bought the HP per spec, didn't like it either and gave it away to a friend...and don't know the logic why my basic, non programable, 19 year old, $10 Target calculator was outlawed. Still don't.

I hardly use calculator for any complex calculation any more. Spreadsheets, MathCAD, proprietary programs like SAP, StaadPro...are great, but still love my old beat up calculator, back from the time struggling between school, work, saving nickel and dimes for books...

Thanks to you all for keeping this thread alive to date. Just check recently, my calculator has a crack on the back now. Probably it's time for it to retire for good. It's gonna be on the top shelf in my closet at home.

Don't we engineers reminisce on good old time and good old thing sometimes?

Regards,

P.N.

POLA

>>> Daryl Richardson <h.d.richardson@shaw.ca> 5/14/2008 3:51 PM >>>

Michel,

It's hard to even find a retail hardware store or lumber dealer that knows what the basic products are any more. Some time ago I went into one of these "one stop carry all" stores to get some Sono Tube for my own sun deck project. The clerk didn't know what it was so he went and got his supervisor. The supervisor didn't know much more; his response was "Why don't you try Revie? They sell saunas."

Regards,

H. Daryl Richardson

----- Original Message -----

From: Michel Blangy

To: seaint@seaint.org ; steel steel ; misc misc

Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:53 PM

Subject: RE: Damaged Calculator

Vish,

Although I am perhaps younger than most on the list, I can sympathize with you. I was raised around a machine shop environment. He was a tool and die maker. I would regularly tag along with my dad on his daily trips to the hardware store. What a collection of tools we now have. How sad it is to see what the local hardware shop has today as compared to yesteryear. My dad could/can fix ANYTHING (except an lcd).

Does anyone here remember the days when one could go down to the hardware store an get a new tube for the television? I don't, but my coworker loves to tell that story.

Michel

-----Original Message-----
From: G Vishwanath [mailto:gvshwnth@yahoo.com]
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2008 9:15 PM
To: steel steel; misc misc; seaint@seaint.org
Subject: Re:Damaged Calculator

Thanks to all who responded with suggestions, and expressions of sympathy and thanks also to all those who were frankly amused by my desire to repair something so inexpensive when a new one could be obtained at perhaps lesser cost.

Put me down as an eccentric fellow.

My mind, heart and soul simply rebels at the thought of casting away a perfectly good calculator whose limbs, brain, heart and soul are in perfect condition even after this act of dare devilry. Only the face is scarred.

Economy is a fetish with me. I am a fellow who does not allow his family to throw away the old tube of toothpaste when they find it difficult extract any more out of it. I use a pair of pliers or tongs and squeeze out two or three more helpings before I reluctantly cast away the old tube. Cranks like me get some weird pleasure out of all this.

Incidentally, the mail to Calculated Industries customer service center that I had reproduced in my previous mail bounced. So now getting it repaired is out of question.

I will use it to adorn my office show case or perhaps as a good paper weight.

Regards

Vish

RE: Alterations Chapter 34 2007 CBC

Jeff,

I think you are interpreting the code properly, but I think there has to be some logic here, too. In you case, with a flexible diaphragm, reducing the shear strength of a line of lateral resistance by more than 10% shouldn't trigger having to upgrade the entire building, just the line of resistance affected.

Larry Hauer, S.E.

> From: jeffsmith7@comcast.net
> To: seaint@seaint.org
> Subject: Alterations Chapter 34 2007 CBC
> Date: Thu, 15 May 2008 10:16:39 -0700
>
>
> I am interpreting section 3403.2.3.2 to require that an entire building
> needs to be seismically upgraded if any seismically resisting element has
> its strength reduced by more than 10%. In the case of a concrete shearwall
> flexible diaphragm building, if you punch a whole in an exterior shear wall
> and reduce the strength by 10% you have to upgrade the whole building, not
> just the altered shear wall or do the exceptions 1-4 allow just the altered
> wall to be strengthend?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jeff
>
>
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RE: enercalc 6 - 2d frame

Not much.

is anyone having any luck using the 2d frame module (revised fastframe) in the new enercalc?

RE: C & C pressures, trusses

ASCE 7's wind provisions are certainly far from perfect (or simple at
times), but they do have a method to their madness! <grin>

Regards,

Scott
Adrian, MI

-----Original Message-----
From: Conrad Harrison [mailto:sch.tectonic@bigpond.com]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 4:09 AM
To: seaint@seaint.org
Subject: RE: C & C pressures, trusses

Thanks Scott

I think I have it figured. You are right.

The commentary mentions deriving the C&C pressures from enveloping the
extreme pressures obtained from a model rotated through 360 degrees in a
wind tunnel.

To AS1170.2 I have to work such effects out, it would typically be the
longitudinal loading which produces a symmetrical loading: I would magnify
those pressures for small tributary areas.

Thanks for the feedback.

Regards
Conrad Harrison
B.Tech (mfg & mech), MIIE, gradTIEAust mailto:sch.tectonic@bigpond.com
Adelaide South Australia

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RE: C & C pressures, trusses

Thanks Scott

I think I have it figured. You are right.

The commentary mentions deriving the C&C pressures from enveloping the
extreme pressures obtained from a model rotated through 360 degrees in a
wind tunnel.

To AS1170.2 I have to work such effects out, it would typically be the
longitudinal loading which produces a symmetrical loading: I would magnify
those pressures for small tributary areas.

Thanks for the feedback.

Regards
Conrad Harrison
B.Tech (mfg & mech), MIIE, gradTIEAust
mailto:sch.tectonic@bigpond.com
Adelaide
South Australia

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Thursday, May 15, 2008

Re: porches in seismic areas

Tension perpendicular to grain. Not very attractive.

Ralph

In a message dated 5/15/08 3:18:16 PM, jrgrill@cableone.net writes:

For loads in the perpendicular direction the bolts resist the column base moment in bolt values perpendicular to grain. Any thoughts?

**************
Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food.
(http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod00030000000001)

Re: porches in seismic areas

I seem to remember hearing about these double holdowns wood moment
connections and how they failed during the Northridge EQ. I don't
remember the details, but I expect the forces in the bolts were greater
than designed and there was slippage. Does this seem familiar to any of
you who did forensics after that EQ?

Joseph R. Grill wrote:
> Yes, I was thinking lighter loads. Also, only "similar" to a Simpson base.
> If the side plates are taller, say 12", then the bolts could have a 9"
> spacing. A 5/8" bolt in a 6x6 DF would give you 1420x1.6=2272 lbs per bolt.
> At 9" couple that would give a 1704 ft-lb moment resistance. At 7' you
> could restrain a 240# lateral load. That would be for the bolts only. At 90
> degrees that same 240 lbs applied at the top (I'm being kind of general
> here) of two 3" wide plates produces a moment at the bottom of the plates of
> 1440 in-lbs (if I'm correct). Looks like 2-3/8" plates might work at the 90
> degree situation. Depends on how big the porch and how many posts resisting
> the seismic or wind. If deflections at the top of the post are agreeable, if
> may be work.
> Joe
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: chris.slater@gmail.com [mailto:chris.slater@gmail.com] On Behalf Of
> Chris Slater
> Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2008 4:00 PM
> To: seaint@seaint.org
> Subject: Re: porches in seismic areas
>
> I think the loads would have to be incredibly light.
>
> Given a 7' column, with only 500# of lateral load, you get 3500 #-ft.
> That's resisted by the couple in the bolts, at 3" apart. So each bolt
> winds up needing to be able to resist 14 kips. Pretty sure NDS values
> for through bolts in double shear are at the most in the 4 kip range.
> Maybe less...
>
> Am I missing something?
>
>

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RE: porches in seismic areas

Chris,
May want to look at the plate forces a bit closer. I may not have looked
close enough at the forces at the plates which may be larger due to the
moment from the column moment. I was winging it without sketches. I'll
look at it a bit more this evening also.
Joe

-----Original Message-----
From: chris.slater@gmail.com [mailto:chris.slater@gmail.com] On Behalf Of
Chris Slater
Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2008 4:48 PM
To: seaint@seaint.org
Subject: Re: porches in seismic areas

That makes sense. One more option to put in the holster.

Thanks!

On Thu, May 15, 2008 at 4:35 PM, Joseph R. Grill <jrgrill@cableone.net>
wrote:
> Yes, I was thinking lighter loads. Also, only "similar" to a Simpson base.
> If the side plates are taller, say 12", then the bolts could have a 9"
> spacing. A 5/8" bolt in a 6x6 DF would give you 1420x1.6=2272 lbs per
bolt.
> At 9" couple that would give a 1704 ft-lb moment resistance. At 7' you
> could restrain a 240# lateral load. That would be for the bolts only. At
90
> degrees that same 240 lbs applied at the top (I'm being kind of general
> here) of two 3" wide plates produces a moment at the bottom of the plates
of
> 1440 in-lbs (if I'm correct). Looks like 2-3/8" plates might work at the
90
> degree situation. Depends on how big the porch and how many posts
resisting
> the seismic or wind. If deflections at the top of the post are agreeable,
if
> may be work.
> Joe
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: chris.slater@gmail.com [mailto:chris.slater@gmail.com] On Behalf Of
> Chris Slater
> Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2008 4:00 PM
> To: seaint@seaint.org
> Subject: Re: porches in seismic areas
>
> I think the loads would have to be incredibly light.
>
> Given a 7' column, with only 500# of lateral load, you get 3500 #-ft.
> That's resisted by the couple in the bolts, at 3" apart. So each bolt
> winds up needing to be able to resist 14 kips. Pretty sure NDS values
> for through bolts in double shear are at the most in the 4 kip range.
> Maybe less...
>
> Am I missing something?
>
> On Thu, May 15, 2008 at 3:14 PM, Joseph R. Grill <jrgrill@cableone.net>
> wrote:
>> Another option? But, probably for lighter laterally loaded columns.
> Using
>> a column base, shaped similarly to a Simpson CB or LCB but heavier plates
>> and bolts. For loads in one direction the side plates resist the column
>> base moment by bending. For loads in the perpendicular direction the
> bolts
>> resist the column base moment in bolt values perpendicular to grain. Any
>> thoughts?
>>
>> Joe Grill
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Jnapd@aol.com [mailto:Jnapd@aol.com]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 12:43 PM
>> To: seaint@seaint.org
>> Subject: Re: porches in seismic areas
>>
>>
>>
>> Andrew
>>
>>
>>
>> You are correct steel tubes are not that expensive and I use them all the
>> time. Contractors and home owners freak out when you mention steel. They
>> don't understand where to buy, how to use and therefore it must cost way
> to
>> much is the normal response.
>>
>>
>>
>> I tell clients all the time you can use the City or County spec for knee
>> braced patio supports; but if you go beyond the size they recommend I
will
>> not sign or approve any knee-braced wood post..no exceptions.
>>
>>
>>
>> Dennis and I do most of our work within 0-15 km of the San Andreas Fault.
>> Our area has been expecting a 6.5 - 7.5 Quake for the last 20 years.
>> Landers and Big Bear quakes were not on the main fault branch.
>>
>>
>>
>> What I do when requested is install a 6x6 post inside a HSS6x6x.25
column.
>> The tube extends 2-3 ft above ground with the post embedded 12' into
steel
>> tube. Clients put stone or brick around the tube so you see just the
wood.
>> The height of the wood depends on how many post are available.
>>
>>
>>
>> I always consider a trellis roof as a solid roof..because within 5 years
> it
>> usually is.
>>
>>
>>
>> I sleep quite well at night.
>>
>>
>>
>> Joe Venuti
>> Johnson & Nielsen Associates
>> Palm Springs, CA
>>
>> ________________________________
>>
>> Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites
at
>> AOL Food.
>
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Re: porches in seismic areas

That makes sense. One more option to put in the holster.

Thanks!

On Thu, May 15, 2008 at 4:35 PM, Joseph R. Grill <jrgrill@cableone.net> wrote:
> Yes, I was thinking lighter loads. Also, only "similar" to a Simpson base.
> If the side plates are taller, say 12", then the bolts could have a 9"
> spacing. A 5/8" bolt in a 6x6 DF would give you 1420x1.6=2272 lbs per bolt.
> At 9" couple that would give a 1704 ft-lb moment resistance. At 7' you
> could restrain a 240# lateral load. That would be for the bolts only. At 90
> degrees that same 240 lbs applied at the top (I'm being kind of general
> here) of two 3" wide plates produces a moment at the bottom of the plates of
> 1440 in-lbs (if I'm correct). Looks like 2-3/8" plates might work at the 90
> degree situation. Depends on how big the porch and how many posts resisting
> the seismic or wind. If deflections at the top of the post are agreeable, if
> may be work.
> Joe
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: chris.slater@gmail.com [mailto:chris.slater@gmail.com] On Behalf Of
> Chris Slater
> Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2008 4:00 PM
> To: seaint@seaint.org
> Subject: Re: porches in seismic areas
>
> I think the loads would have to be incredibly light.
>
> Given a 7' column, with only 500# of lateral load, you get 3500 #-ft.
> That's resisted by the couple in the bolts, at 3" apart. So each bolt
> winds up needing to be able to resist 14 kips. Pretty sure NDS values
> for through bolts in double shear are at the most in the 4 kip range.
> Maybe less...
>
> Am I missing something?
>
> On Thu, May 15, 2008 at 3:14 PM, Joseph R. Grill <jrgrill@cableone.net>
> wrote:
>> Another option? But, probably for lighter laterally loaded columns.
> Using
>> a column base, shaped similarly to a Simpson CB or LCB but heavier plates
>> and bolts. For loads in one direction the side plates resist the column
>> base moment by bending. For loads in the perpendicular direction the
> bolts
>> resist the column base moment in bolt values perpendicular to grain. Any
>> thoughts?
>>
>> Joe Grill
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Jnapd@aol.com [mailto:Jnapd@aol.com]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 12:43 PM
>> To: seaint@seaint.org
>> Subject: Re: porches in seismic areas
>>
>>
>>
>> Andrew
>>
>>
>>
>> You are correct steel tubes are not that expensive and I use them all the
>> time. Contractors and home owners freak out when you mention steel. They
>> don't understand where to buy, how to use and therefore it must cost way
> to
>> much is the normal response.
>>
>>
>>
>> I tell clients all the time you can use the City or County spec for knee
>> braced patio supports; but if you go beyond the size they recommend I will
>> not sign or approve any knee-braced wood post..no exceptions.
>>
>>
>>
>> Dennis and I do most of our work within 0-15 km of the San Andreas Fault.
>> Our area has been expecting a 6.5 - 7.5 Quake for the last 20 years.
>> Landers and Big Bear quakes were not on the main fault branch.
>>
>>
>>
>> What I do when requested is install a 6x6 post inside a HSS6x6x.25 column.
>> The tube extends 2-3 ft above ground with the post embedded 12' into steel
>> tube. Clients put stone or brick around the tube so you see just the wood.
>> The height of the wood depends on how many post are available.
>>
>>
>>
>> I always consider a trellis roof as a solid roof..because within 5 years
> it
>> usually is.
>>
>>
>>
>> I sleep quite well at night.
>>
>>
>>
>> Joe Venuti
>> Johnson & Nielsen Associates
>> Palm Springs, CA
>>
>> ________________________________
>>
>> Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at
>> AOL Food.
>
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RE: porches in seismic areas

Yes, I was thinking lighter loads. Also, only "similar" to a Simpson base.
If the side plates are taller, say 12", then the bolts could have a 9"
spacing. A 5/8" bolt in a 6x6 DF would give you 1420x1.6=2272 lbs per bolt.
At 9" couple that would give a 1704 ft-lb moment resistance. At 7' you
could restrain a 240# lateral load. That would be for the bolts only. At 90
degrees that same 240 lbs applied at the top (I'm being kind of general
here) of two 3" wide plates produces a moment at the bottom of the plates of
1440 in-lbs (if I'm correct). Looks like 2-3/8" plates might work at the 90
degree situation. Depends on how big the porch and how many posts resisting
the seismic or wind. If deflections at the top of the post are agreeable, if
may be work.
Joe

-----Original Message-----
From: chris.slater@gmail.com [mailto:chris.slater@gmail.com] On Behalf Of
Chris Slater
Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2008 4:00 PM
To: seaint@seaint.org
Subject: Re: porches in seismic areas

I think the loads would have to be incredibly light.

Given a 7' column, with only 500# of lateral load, you get 3500 #-ft.
That's resisted by the couple in the bolts, at 3" apart. So each bolt
winds up needing to be able to resist 14 kips. Pretty sure NDS values
for through bolts in double shear are at the most in the 4 kip range.
Maybe less...

Am I missing something?

On Thu, May 15, 2008 at 3:14 PM, Joseph R. Grill <jrgrill@cableone.net>
wrote:
> Another option? But, probably for lighter laterally loaded columns.
Using
> a column base, shaped similarly to a Simpson CB or LCB but heavier plates
> and bolts. For loads in one direction the side plates resist the column
> base moment by bending. For loads in the perpendicular direction the
bolts
> resist the column base moment in bolt values perpendicular to grain. Any
> thoughts?
>
> Joe Grill
>
>
>
> From: Jnapd@aol.com [mailto:Jnapd@aol.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 12:43 PM
> To: seaint@seaint.org
> Subject: Re: porches in seismic areas
>
>
>
> Andrew
>
>
>
> You are correct steel tubes are not that expensive and I use them all the
> time. Contractors and home owners freak out when you mention steel. They
> don't understand where to buy, how to use and therefore it must cost way
to
> much is the normal response.
>
>
>
> I tell clients all the time you can use the City or County spec for knee
> braced patio supports; but if you go beyond the size they recommend I will
> not sign or approve any knee-braced wood post..no exceptions.
>
>
>
> Dennis and I do most of our work within 0-15 km of the San Andreas Fault.
> Our area has been expecting a 6.5 - 7.5 Quake for the last 20 years.
> Landers and Big Bear quakes were not on the main fault branch.
>
>
>
> What I do when requested is install a 6x6 post inside a HSS6x6x.25 column.
> The tube extends 2-3 ft above ground with the post embedded 12' into steel
> tube. Clients put stone or brick around the tube so you see just the wood.
> The height of the wood depends on how many post are available.
>
>
>
> I always consider a trellis roof as a solid roof..because within 5 years
it
> usually is.
>
>
>
> I sleep quite well at night.
>
>
>
> Joe Venuti
> Johnson & Nielsen Associates
> Palm Springs, CA
>
> ________________________________
>
> Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at
> AOL Food.

******* ****** ******* ******** ******* ******* ******* ***
* Read list FAQ at: http://www.seaint.org/list_FAQ.asp
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* without your permission. Make sure you visit our web
* site at: http://www.seaint.org

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* without your permission. Make sure you visit our web
* site at: http://www.seaint.org

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