SGE Structural wrote:
> David,
>
>
> It appears to me that whatever the venue, the problem has much more to
> do with politics than with structural engineering. It is in our own
> backyard - not in Italy - where everybody knows about the dire
> situation with dams in the Sacramento area. This is not some unknown
> future earthquake, this is for real
>
> V. Steve Gordin, SE
> Irvine CA
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* David Topete <mailto:d.topete73@gmail.com>
> *To:* seaint@seaint.org <mailto:seaint@seaint.org>
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 09, 2009 08:44
> *Subject:* Re: "It's not in our culture"
>
> Because of Loma Prieta, Northridge and Kobe, our building code has
> grown in quantity and quality. We are constantly learning from
> each event. Unfortunately, it seems that not everyone in the AEC
> industry is quite on board with the movement.
>
> It doesn't matter if a structure is designed to meet the minimum
> standards of a building code if poor workmanship or construction
> materials (i.e. owner's cash money) trumps the engineering design
> intent. A building will behave as it's constructed, and not as
> it's designed...
>
> On Thu, Apr 9, 2009 at 8:26 AM, Scott, William N
> <William.N.Scott@conocophillips.com
> <mailto:William.N.Scott@conocophillips.com>> wrote:
>
> Ralph,
>
> If I remember correctly, Northridge and Loma Pieta showed us
> that our codes and engineering are not perfect. These quakes
> were a short 15-sec.
>
> Bill
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* Rhkratzse@aol.com <mailto:Rhkratzse@aol.com>
> [mailto:Rhkratzse@aol.com <mailto:Rhkratzse@aol.com>]
> *Sent:* Wednesday, April 08, 2009 12:45 PM
> *To:* Scott, William N; seaint@seaint.org
> <mailto:seaint@seaint.org>
> *Subject:* Re: "It's not in our culture"
>
> Bill, I do realize that many Italian buildings are way old,
> and that many of them would be very expensive to retrofit.
> That said, if your kids were in an obviously fragile old
> school building would you want your officials telling you that
> "fixing them, and thus saving your children's lives, is just
> not in our culture"??
>
> About 5 years ago I went to an exhibit in San Francisco of
> some very flashy, high-tech analysis and retrofit designs for
> just such old stone structures, giving the impression that
> they were addressing this subject. Now I find that "it isn't
> in our culture," which rather surprises me.
>
> The problem with "knowing the risk and accepting it" is that
> the knowers and acceptors are seldom the ones who suffer the
> consequences. Sort of like the Big Shot Financiers driving
> our economy to ruin and bailing out with multimillion-dollar
> bonuses.
>
> Bet none of the guys who made a killing (so to speak) on the
> improperly constructed newish school that collapsed had any of
> their own kids in it. They never do.
>
> Lastly, I do recognize that the guy who made the comment --
> Enzo Boschi, president of the National Institute of Geophysics
> and Vulcanology (wow, they have their own institute?!) -- is
> only one person, and he is probably very sorry he opened his
> mouth, true though his statement may be.
>
> Ralph Hueston Kratz, S.E.
> Richmond CA USA
>
> In a message dated 4/8/09 9:22:30 AM,
> William.N.Scott@conocophillips.com
> <mailto:William.N.Scott@conocophillips.com> writes:
> You need to realize that many buildings in these towns were
> 1000-years old or more. Renovations to these structures would
> damage the charm and would be expensive.
>
> Italians know the seismic risk and can chose to accept them.
>
> Bill
>
>
>
> *From:* Rhkratzse@aol.com <mailto:Rhkratzse@aol.com>
> [mailto:Rhkratzse@aol.com <mailto:Rhkratzse@aol.com>]
> *Sent:* Wednesday, April 08, 2009 7:12 AM
> *To:* seaint@seaint.org <mailto:seaint@seaint.org>
> *Subject:* "It's not in our culture"
>
> As reported by AP/ENR, an Italian government official stated
> that "It's not in our culture to construct buildings the
> right way in a quake zone - that is, build buildings that can
> resist (quakes) and retrofit old ones. This has never been done."
>
> They say you get a mule to do what you want by first getting
> its attention by hitting it on the head with a 2x4. I would
> think that had already been done in Italy's case, by past
> devastating earthquakes, but I guess not.
>
> Ralph
>
>
>
> **************
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>
>
>
>
>
> --
> David Topete, SE
>
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